The Gentle Art of Changing a Mind

“People are generally better persuaded by the reasons which they have themselves discovered than by those which have come into the mind of others.” — Blaise Pascal

How many therapists does it take to change a light bulb? Only one, but the light bulb has to really want to change. (Old joke, I use it a lot.)

Several days ago one of my granddaughters announced, with the calm confidence only a young person can possess, that she intended to drive about fifteen hours by herself across the wide and lonely stretches of the American West. Seattle to Wyoming. In June.

She will be a brand-new driver. Will have had her license for a week. A long road. Miles of sagebrush, empty highways, and small towns separated by hours.

I felt a tightening in my chest.

Grandparents carry a special kind of worry. Parents worry too, of course, but grandparents have lived long enough to see how fragile life can be. We know that sometimes things go wrong not because someone is foolish, but because the world is unpredictable.

My first instinct was simple. Tell her no. In fact, I kinda did.

Tell her it was unwise. I kinda did.

Tell her it was irresponsible. I kinda did.

Tell her she was not ready. I kinda did.

Surprise, surprise. None of that made a dent in her plan.

If I had not been so panicked at the mere thought, I would have at least tried to dredge up my experience and bit of learning around what is called "motivational interviewing." More about that coming up.

Here’s what most of us know about young people and perhaps people in general. The moment you try to push them away from an idea, they often push right back toward it.

The human mind is like that.

When we feel our freedom threatened, we defend it.

Psychologists call this reactance. The more someone presses us, the more we resist.

Enter motivational interviewing. It’s a method used by counselors, doctors, and conflict mediators. The approach was developed by the psychologists William R. Miller and Stephen Rollnick.

Their discovery was surprising.

When counselors, doctors, mentors, and coaches argued with people about changing their behavior—whether drinking, smoking, or risky habits—the clients usually resisted. But when mentors asked thoughtful questions and helped people explore their own thinking, something different happened.

People began persuading themselves.

It turns out that human beings are much more influenced by the ideas they themselves say out loud than by the ideas someone else lectures them about.

Aha. Perhaps the best way to influence my granddaughter would not be to correct her. Perhaps it would be to ask her questions.

The first principle of motivational interviewing is simple: begin with curiosity.

Instead of saying, “That’s a terrible idea,” you begin with something like this:

“What appeals to you about doing that trip?”

That question does two important things. First, it communicates respect. Second, it helps you understand what the person is actually thinking.

When I imagine asking my granddaughter that question, I can almost hear her answer.

Maybe she wants adventure. Maybe she wants to prove she is independent. Maybe she wants to see if she can handle life on her own.

Those are not bad motivations. In fact, they are part of growing up.

The second skill in motivational interviewing is something psychologists call reflective listening.

Instead of jumping in with advice, you repeat back what you hear. This is soooo hard when it is your own flesh and blood.

“So you want to show yourself that you can handle a big trip on your own.”

It sounds simple, but something powerful happens when people feel understood. Their defenses lower. They relax. They begin thinking rather than arguing.

The goal is not to trap someone in their own logic. The goal is to help them think more deeply.

The next step is what the researchers call evoking “change talk.” This happens when someone begins expressing their own concerns or wisdom about a situation.

One of the most effective questions in motivational interviewing is this context might be:

“What do you think might be the hardest part of that trip?”

Notice the difference between that question and a lecture.

A lecture sounds like this:

“You’ll get tired. You might break down. There are long empty stretches with no help.” I already tried that lecture approach anyway. No dice.

But a question invites the person to think.

“What might be the hardest part?” Now the wisdom comes from them.

“Maybe the long empty highways.”

“Maybe getting tired.”

“Maybe if the car broke down.”

When people say those things themselves, they become far more persuasive than when someone else says them.

Another helpful question follows naturally. “How would you handle that if it happened?”

Now the conversation has shifted. Instead of defending the plan, the person begins planning.

Motivational interviewing teaches another gentle question that often helps people step back and think more broadly.

“What might make that idea safer or easier?”

Now the conversation becomes collaborative rather than confrontational.

Perhaps the trip could be shorter. Perhaps she could bring a friend. Perhaps she could break it into two days.

None of those suggestions take away her independence. They simply add wisdom to the adventure.

What I find so beautiful about this approach is that it honors something deep within human beings.

We want to choose (remember that blog about even rats wanting autonomy. That blog is also about the 6 stages of change. Motivational interviewing is not mentioned but it is often used in those early stages. We humans don't want anyone to be "the boss of me" which we start telling people by two years of age.). We want to grow. We want to feel capable.

Now I must insert here my husband bristling when I told him of a friend who was upset because her children were insisting that she could no longer stay by herself at age 83. No discussion. An edict. Yes, she had a fall. Yes, she had some mild cognitive impairment.

John was ready to kill on her behalf.  “Who do those kids think they are telling her how to live her life?!”

Motivational interviewing respects people’s autonomy and desire for self-determination rather than fighting them. People respectfully collaborate.

Another researcher who studies persuasion, the organizational psychologist Adam Grant, says that the most effective persuaders behave less like prosecutors and more like scientists. They are curious about how people think.

Curiosity is disarming. Curiosity invites reflection. Curiosity opens the door to change.

This whole approach reminds me of something interesting about the way Jesus taught.

The Gospels portray Jesus of Nazareth as asking an astonishing number of questions, the internet comes up with 307 or so. Scholars who have counted them point out that Jesus was asked many questions (186ish), yet he often responded with questions of his own.

Instead of delivering lectures, he invited people to think.

When a lawyer asked him, “Who is my neighbor?” Jesus did not answer with a definition.

He told the story of the Good Samaritan.

At the end of the story he asked a question.

“Which of these was a neighbor?”

The listener answered the question himself.

The insight did not come as a command.

It came as a discovery.

That teaching style is remarkably similar to what modern psychologists have rediscovered.

Questions awaken the mind.

Stories soften the heart.

People rarely change when they feel forced, but they often change when they see something new.

Of course, knowing this does not remove my worry.

The thought of my granddaughter alone on a distant highway still makes me uneasy.

Grandparents know too much about the unexpected. But perhaps wisdom is not something we can pour into another person like water into a glass. Perhaps wisdom grows best when it is drawn out.

So rather than hoping she flunks her driving test, I can be more supportive, more skilled, more respectful.

This is the quiet genius of motivational interviewing. Instead of fighting human nature, it works with it.

Miller and Rollnick describe the spirit, the mindset, of the approach with four simple attitudes: partnership, acceptance, compassion, and evocation.

Partnership means we work with people rather than trying to control them. Yes, I know, it is so hard to let go when we are so very sure of ourselves.

Acceptance means we respect their autonomy. Compassion means we genuinely care about their wellbeing. Evocation means we draw out their own wisdom. And maybe we dig down deep in ourselves and throw in a dash of humility for good measure.

Because the truth is, sometimes we are wrong, yes, even us.

Sometimes the young teach the old.

Sometimes courage grows where we expected fear.

But even when we worry, we can still guide gently with a respectful, collaborative, curious mindset. And sometimes gentle guidance travels farther than force.

When I think about the road my granddaughter wants to travel, I imagine the long ribbon of highway stretching through desert and mountain.

I imagine the thrill of independence.

I imagine the risks.

And I remind myself that growing up has always involved a mixture of freedom and wisdom. Maybe the best gift I can offer her is not control.

Maybe the best gift is a conversation that helps her think carefully and choose wisely.

That is, after all, the heart of motivational interviewing.

Not changing someone’s mind by force.

Helping them discover their own best thinking.

And that may be the most powerful form of influence there is.

Now, let’s take a little shift to remind ourselves of our aims - to give our wisdom or unleash theirs, which is it? At the community meal on Thursday an exuberant man, very passionate in his political ideas, came up to me with excitement. 

“I took a course, I now know how to change people’s minds!”  I congratulated him, he’s a nice enough fellow. But secretly I thought, “good luck” with that, my friend. Why the attitude? Because I know how passionately he wants to give people the truckload of facts and figures he has in his head, set them straight.

He showed me who I don’t want to be with my granddaughter or anyone else. A zealous pusher for my ideas, my way, my wisdom. Which seems, according to researchers, not very effective though it might make us feel better for a second.

Still, next time when I talk to him, I’ll conjure up more curiosity to replace my dismissive judgment.

In the meantime, if you ever find yourself, like me, wanting to change someone’s mind—whether a teenager, a friend, or even someone with different political views—here are a few simple ideas worth remembering from the pros.

Start with curiosity rather than correction. Ask what appeals to them about their idea.

Listen carefully and reflect back what you hear so they know they are understood. Ask thoughtful questions like “What might be the hardest part?” or “What concerns do you have?”

Invite them to imagine safer or wiser ways to reach the same goal. Resist the urge to lecture or overwhelm them with facts. Remember that people are more persuaded by the reasons they discover themselves than by the reasons others give them. Keep the relationship warm and respectful, because trust opens minds more effectively than pressure.

And perhaps most importantly, remember to ask good questions. Sometimes a good question can travel farther than a long argument. Maybe share a story. And…sometimes minds can change. 

It’s rare I know to change a mind.  How often have I, have you, changed your own mind? It’s not a common occurrence.  We hold on stubbornly to our perspectives…we rarely seek out disconfirming evidence.  Even scientists are not good at this. 

Remember when we used to talk about paradigm shifts? Mostly we have to wait for the old guard to die before new ways of thinking can be accepted…even in science. There’s just a lot of baggage working against that shift. But motivational interviewing guys have the best process I know of.  Health providers, coaches, therapists have had quite good success with it.

Clearly, motivational interviewing was originally designed as a conversation with another person, but its founders have noted that the same principles can be used internally. In other words, we can learn to guide our own thinking with the same curiosity and compassion we would offer someone else. More on that at a later date.

How might we use the power of a motivational interviewing mindset (first take a breath if you are really passionate about what needs to change, use curiosity like a scientist, practice reflective listening, evoke change talk, and continue with gentle follow-ups) to help us change others’ (and maybe even our own) minds?

When I was cleaning out some books, arrrghh, I found an original 1997 copy of Portia Nelson’s book – There’s a Hole in My Sidewalk.  That poem, “Autobiography in Five Chapters” I wrote about here in an earlier blog is a beautiful way to mindfully reflect on our lives and also to hold on to our motivation and values going forward.  Here’s an autobiography in answer to Portia’s from a distinguished reader of the blog. I love it.

I

I walk down the street.

There is a deep hole in the sidewalk (home is not safe, life is not safe)

I fall in. (the hole is wide, no choice but to fall in)

I am lost...I am helpless. (there are no support structures in place)

It isn’t my fault. (It isn’t anyone’s fault; it is the way it is)

It takes me forever to find a way out. (but I know I MUST find a way

out – self-pity drowns you)

II

I walk down the same street.

There is a deep hole in the sidewalk. (same hole, same growing up

environment – everyone around me is in the same hole – I know no

difference – no other way to address life – there is security in common

struggle – however, uncertainty creates uneasiness)

I pretend I don’t see it. (Not acknowledging peril is a defense

mechanism – ignoring peril puts dealing with it)

I fall in again. (no other choices are available – I have no experience,

role models, etc. on how to deal with not failing in the hole repeatedly)

I can’t believe I am in the same place but, it isn’t my fault. (Well, it will

always be my fault until I accept responsibility for falling in the hole,

looking for role models who have avoided the hole, and seek support,

but where in the current culture will I find role models and support –

they don’t exist)

It still takes a long time to get out. (why be in a hurry, no one else has

figured it out and many seem to enjoy a culture of self-pity – they are

comfortable being uncomfortable)

III

I walk down the same street.

There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.

I see it is there.

I still fall in...it’s a habit, but (I realize this habit is not taking my life in a

direction I would like to go. I want more from life than constant fear

and a cultural/family belief that I have nothing to contribute – which I

have decided should be my purpose in life and something that brings

me joy. I must find a way to avoid the hole, change family and friends,

leave the past behind, including family and friends who are not

contributing to my goal/purpose. Leaving family and friends is painful,

but I must take a different path and find ways of increasing self-

efficacy and be vulnerable to criticism and family identity.)

my eyes are open

I know where I am (on a moving plate)

It is my fault. (but only if I don’t act, as painful as it will be)

I get out immediately. (But I will always feel the pull back given family

history and childhood environment – there will always be doubt, but

the emptiness of not contributing outweighs the strong cultural

magnetic pull to return to the comfort of “not good enough” to

contribute. Still getting out each day.)

IV

I walk down the same street. (Daily until we don’t)

There is a deep hole in the sidewalk. (I see it each day)

I walk around it. (Doing my best to make the most of the best and the

least of the worst. Life is a journey – lift your feet up when you see the

hole coming – travel with people who support your purpose)

V

I walk down another street. (I continue to look ahead, watch for

“holes” and be alert to opportunities to contribute)

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The granddaughter just called. Said she got her permit today. She could drive me all around now. I did ask at least two questions, made two reflections, but she still outmaneuvered me.  She is driving us both to coffee in the morning. I can live with that.